Lla Dafern/Archive 17

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Bengwenid! Bieńwięty! Moyn moyn! Bemmeinde! Pemmenut! Benvenuto! Welcome!

This is Lla Dafern, or, as the Saxon invaders call it, The Pub. It is one of many places where the members of Ill Bethisad enjoy meeting each other informally. It is the place where opinions can be exchanged and questions can be asked concerning Ill Bethisad in general or about topics that do not fit in the Talk compartment of individual wiki pages. It is also the place where technical questions can be asked to the moderators of this wiki.

THE MENU: Our chef, whose nationality for reasons of security will remain undisclosed, offers you a broad assortiment of Helvetian and other specialties, such as Montreiano Sea Elephant steaks with rended blubber, or if you prefer a side of Pacific white sided dolphin babyback ribs. He will be more than happy to give you a demonstration of his culinary talents. Just keep your health insurance card ready! And if you aren't particularly hungry today, he will also happily treat you on a rosy-scented Jervan Muscatel, a cool Dumnonian cider, a warm Irish or a cold Batavian beer, or, if you are amongst the more daring, a true Venedic jekwiała. For those who appreciate fine wines we carry the rich red wines of Bordeaux and les Ozarques, Brandy or Montignac, and bin ruper from Hostreht in Xliponia. For the discerning, a good 1984 vintage Arvorec anaf aval is recommended as an apéritif. Especially for minors and teetotallers we also serve Coke, orange juice, goat milk, Italian Limonata, and Neofrancian Spruce beer. If you prefer a more active pursuit to accompany your imbibition, there's a rousing game of puir-man whummlin going on out back. There's even an occasional pickup match of hibercrosse. Cheerio!

WARNING: Please don't pay attention to the smoke, the noise and the mess. Watch your steps and don't break your neck over cables, books, broken chairs, empty beer cans, leftovers of cigarettes and snacks...our bus boys get to it when they can...

DISCLAIMERS: The management is not responsible for physical or mental damage inflicted upon our guests, especially when it is caused by the food, by the BioCola, by the regular rioting here, or by any other kind of misbehaviour on anyone's part.
Any similarity to what the Wikipedians call The Village Pump is not entirely coincidental.

NOTA BENE: You can sign your messages by typing ~~~ for just your name and ~~~~ for your name + timestamp.

The current Ill Bethisad Collaboration of the Fortnight is: Franco-Prussian War.   Every fortnight a different topic, stub or non-existent article is picked by nomination.
Please read the nomination text and improve the article any way you can. 


2005: February – July | August – September | October | November | December
2006: January | February | March | April | May | June | July – September | October – December
2007: January – June | July – December
2008: January – June | July – December


James Bond

With Quantum of a Solace coming out in November, more and more James Bond wiki advertisements of James Bond Wiki are showing up. That got me to thinking, where's James Bond in IB?? Misterxeight 01:04, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

Ill Bethisad seems to be getting quite complex... So much that even we, who have been around for some time already, must perform a search in order to find things we're sure must have been published somewhere! Anyway, IB's parallel to James Bond is Jaunge Blone (on the Movies page). Cheers! Kyrmse 12:24, 2 July 2008 (UTC)

But How?

How does one go about making a wikipedia-like website. By that I mean, the site called "Wiki" has a button called "Created Your Own Wiki", is there something like that for something like this? Misterxeight 00:41, 8 July 2008 (UTC)

Image help

Ok, I give up. I've managed to successfully upload my new Turkestan flag. Now, how do I get it to appear in the appropriate box?

Done. It was merely a matter of changing the extention from .png to .PNG. Mind, names of articles and files are case sensitive! —IJzeren Jan Uszkiełtu? 14:22, 12 July 2008 (UTC)

Works in Progress

Hello everybody!

Every once in a while it happens that the IB Wiki needs to be cleaned up a little. Just like there shouldn't be 200 proposals at a time, there shouldn't be too many pages carrying other tags either. So, let's talk about work in progress. At present, we have no less than three templates for it: {{wip}}, {{workinprogress}}, and {{wip2}}. The first and second are completely identical, and since the second one is used sporadically, we may as well delete it. The third one doesn't mention the sentence: "This is not yet a proposal":

Work in progress.png

Work in progress
    Comments are welcomed on the talk page. This is not yet a proposal.    

Work in progress.png

Work in progress
    Comments are welcomed on the talk page.    

In my opinion, this distinction is unnecessary, but before taking any action, I'd like to make sure that everybody agrees.

When to use it?

You can use this template when you are currently working on a new page. What you are trying to communicate by using it is this: "Look folks, I know you can't wait to make improvements to this article, but be sure that at this very moment I'm working on it myself, so please wait a few days. You'll see that after that it will be upgraded to a full proposal by then, ready to be discussed." To quote the Guidelines: If you want to be explicit about the article not being finished yet, better use the {{workinprogress}} tag. Remember however, that the purpose of that tag is mainly to warn people that you are currently working on it, so it shouldn't stick around for longer than a week or so.

The tag should not be used for pointing out that an article is unfinished. Ill Bethisad is a work in progress in itself. It is incomplete by definition. We will continuously discover new facts. The IBWiki is meant to be a catalogue of known facts, and therefore, there's no need to point out that an article is not finished yet, as 99 % of all our articles are incomplete and unfinished.

Now let's take a look at the Category:Work in progress. At present, there are 121 articles in it, some of them dating back to 2005! This is obviously not what the template was made for. Therefore, I'd like to ask everybody to take a look at the list, make whatever changes are necessary, remove the template, and either add it to the proposal list or simply QSS-ify it.

Regards, —IJzeren Jan Uszkiełtu? 09:59, 22 July 2008 (UTC)

Grey Political Maps

Where can I find a blank, political map of IB? Like the one used in
this one
this one

Anyone? Misterxeight 22:20, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

I made one in .PNG format (easier to edit with MSPaint) quite a while ago but haven't uploaded it, since people seemed OK with the current ones. Would you like me to put it here? I made it direct from the Wikipedia maps and not from anything in IB, so there might be some slight differences with the existing maps. Benkarnell 00:54, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
Please! I used to have a bunch of them but lost it all in a computer crash--but mine were jpgs that I was editing with Photoshop. BoArthur 13:57, 13 August 2008 (UTC)
Blank IB world.PNG

There you go. It's probably riddled with errors, which I encourage everyone to correct and upload the corrected version. Benkarnell 15:28, 13 August 2008 (UTC)

Strange Symbols

What is this "Þ" and some of characters such as "ş", "ţ", "â", and "å" these mean? Misterxeight 03:52, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

"Þ" is like "th" in English, a voiceless dental fricative, such as in the words thick or thin (but not as in the, which is the voiced dental fricative).
"ş", "ţ", "â", are likely Romanian in their usage here. In French spelling any vowel with the "circonflex" or ^ sign signify that in older French spelling there was an "s" there, as in 'hôtel' (hostel) and 'fôret' (forest) and lastly Neûchâtel (Swiss city) because it was at one time Neufchastel.
"å" is a Nordic language spelling. It stems from the similar spelling background as what gives us Haarlem in Dutch, but to "save space" while printing like the ä,ö and ü, it became å. Prior to this spelling reform they were ae, oe, ue, and aa respectively. It is said in Norwegian and Swedish, the long version (/oː/) is similar to the 'au' in caught or law. In Danish, the long version is pronounced /ɔː/. On this wiki, you'll likely only see it with relation to Rigsmål/Rigsmaal BoArthur 18:05, 29 July 2008 (UTC)

SNOR and snorism

Thanks, Ben, for creating Life under SNORism and Category:SNOR. The article is really cool and the category is more than useful indeed! Ivan Ivanovich Steinberg was a hole in one; how did you know my father's first name was "Hans" (which in Russian would translate as "Ivan"? ;)))

Anyway, there has been quite some noise around the SNOR lately, and it got me wondering about a few things.

First, there is a clear distinction between the SNOR and snorism. The SNOR is a political party that ruled Russia for over six decades. Snorism is the ideology it represents, in a broader sense. I think it shouldn't be written in capitals, as it refers to more things than just to anything related to the SNOR. BTW, I don't think the term "snorism" was ever known to the SNOR itself, at least not before GW2. Hell, I don't even think the SNOR hád a name for its ideology. They'd refer to themselves as "conservatives" or "nationalists", or perhaps "national-conservatives" at best. The term snorism was definitely not coined by the SNOR itself. It was probably the work of the western press, and it may or may not have been adopted at some point in Russia, but if the letter be the case, then it must have been pretty late (not before the 1970s or so).

For that reason, I'm wondering if we shouldn't rename this category to Category:Snorism instead.

SNOR/Snorism is entirely your thing, Jan, and I had not known about the two terms being distinct. I'll make the changes and moves today. And forgive my ignorance, but I had thought that both Jan and Ivan approximated the English name John. I repeated the Ivanovich because it has the "van" in there. But if it works, it works :). Benkarnell 13:40, 30 July 2008 (UTC)


Another thing are flags. As you can see, I've created a page snorist flags. There are a few unknown cases, and a few cases I'm having doubts about. For example the snorist flag of Hungary. It was made just after Marc had come up with the SNOR logo and we got so carried away by it that we started overusing it by sticking it on the flags of several other countries as well. Later, we came to the conclusion that this wouldn't be realistic at all, and so, we replaced those early snorist flags by other ones. This Hungarian one seems to be a leftover. I propose that we simply apply Hungary's current flag to the snorist era. After all, there's nothing on it that would particularly offend the SNOR. And just like the communists *here*, I don't think the SNOR would have changed all national flags to snorist flags either. The same could go for the flags of Uyguristan and Skuodia.

Crimean flag

As for the Crimean flag, I came up with it before I actually found out that the Crimea is quite a hodgepodge of nations. This flag is a distinctively Russian one, and so, I think it could work as a snorist flag. As for the present-day flag, I think we need a new one. IMO it should reflect the Crimea's multinational character. On FOTW there are IIRC two flags of the Crimean Tatar minority, featuring a nice symbol that we might use as well. OTOH, other nationalities should be represented too: the Crimean Goths by their sacred tree, the Greeks and the Russians in some way... Marc, how about giving it a try, eh?

Cheers, —IJzeren Jan Uszkiełtu? 10:40, 30 July 2008 (UTC)

The octogram on the gate at Mangup [1] is a neat symbol. The fortress was built by Greeks and used by Goths and Tatars. A possible national symbol? Benkarnell 19:44, 30 July 2008 (UTC)
You're a genius! —IJzeren Jan Uszkiełtu? 10:16, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
Thanks, but honestly, quickly reading a Wikipedia article isn't much! When I read again, it's unclear whether the structure at Mangup was built by Greeks, and it was used by the Kipchaks, Turkic but not exactly Tatars. So it's primarily a Crimean Goth thing. It _could_ still have been re-interpreted as a pan-Crimean symbol, though. Benkarnell 13:26, 31 July 2008 (UTC)
(UPDATE:) It seems after reading bits of info around the Interwebs, the Greeks did in fact fortify Mangup. So it has Gothic, Turkic, and Greek connections, surely enough to satisfy any Crimean nationalists with an eye for a unifying symbol! Benkarnell 05:44, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

OK, here's my best shot at reproducing the Mangup octogram. Maybe someone with better skills can turn it into a flag for Crimea. Benkarnell 06:28, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

It's lovely, Ben. Thanks a lot! —IJzeren Jan Uszkiełtu? 18:48, 11 August 2008 (UTC)
Thanks. I'll put it on the Crimea page, although I'm not sure what to call it. It's not really a coat of arms, or even an official seal. Benkarnell 14:05, 12 August 2008 (UTC)

Can't Read Any More!

Is it just me, or has the IB Wiki font really been changed to a condensed sans-serif that only the nearsighted can read (from 2 inches away)? !!! Kyrmse 12:52, 7 August 2008 (UTC)

It's probably the zoom on your browser. If you have a scroll button (3 button) mouse, you can try holding down CTRL and scrolling one click at a time up or down to change the zoom. There are keyboard buttons you can click, but I'm not sure of them. BoArthur 15:30, 7 August 2008 (UTC)
It was not the zoom, nor anything else I can identify. Funny thing is: Wikipedia had the same problem! But this morning (I write as the Chinese hold their Olympic opening ceremony) everything was back to normal! Go figure, as they say in the NAL. Kyrmse 13:06, 8 August 2008 (UTC)

Elections in IB

Any major elections coming up *there*? More specifically in the NAL-SLC... Seth 04:52, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

I think 2010 are the next big elections in the NAL. Elemtilas 21:40, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
They had a General Election in 2006, which means the next one should be in 2010, at the end of Gore's term as GM. There might be all kinds of Provincial elections going on between now and then, though. Was there something specific you're looking for? Zahir 01:30, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I think you mean 2000? That was the last general election in the NAL. Or do you mean some other elections? Elemtilas 03:29, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
No, there was a general election for Parliament in 2006. It wasn't supposed to be, just some seats coming up, but Gore persuaded the Cabinet to authorize a general election which they technically could do. His hope was to win a more solid majority and a mandate for his universal health care plan. But the new Covenant Loyalist Party was formed from splinter groups of both the Whigs and the Progressive Conservatives, and they won enough seats that Gore was obliged to form a coalition government with them. There was indeed a general election in 2000, that also coincided with the election (by Parliament) of the General Moderator. Another such election is scheduled for 2010, but unless something drastic happens there's no reason to suppose one will occur prior that. Zahir 06:59, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Ouisconsin's next legislative election is in 2009, and its next gubernatorial election in 2010. Benkarnell 12:42, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Ter Mair's next gubernatorial election is also 2009, the lord governors having five year terms. I don't know when the next legislative election will be. And by the way Dr. Zahir, I do now recall the universal health care business -- but would such an unusual election be termed "general"? Or is it a general election cos he made a big fuss about it? ;))) The way things are headed in IB's America, anything could happen between now and 2010! Elemtilas 17:44, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
It was a "General Election" because virtually the entire Parliament faced the polls. And while in theory almost anything could happen, methinks it would take something really...strange...to force another general election so soon. By-elections are something else, though. Those happen all the time, because seats become vacant for one reason or another, or because of some clause in each province's charter (methods of choosing Senators are up to each province). Zahir 18:00, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
I'm interested in Pennsylvaania, What with Gen. Tomos Busbe gunning for a Parliamentary seat... Seth 05:47, 8 September 2008 (UTC)

On the other hand, in Russia we should probably start to think about the possibility of new presidential election (perhaps Kuskov might go up to presidency) or re-election of Igor Arensky. Arensky is being president since 1999 and surely in the new more or less democratic Russia *there* elections are still made.--Pedromoderno 13:19, 8 September 2008 (UTC)


I just noticed, we have no article for Montenegro. Misterxeight 15:37, 6 September 2008 (UTC)

That's OK. Someday, someone might come along to fill in some blanks. We don't write articles for places simply because there's no article! Elemtilas 21:40, 6 September 2008 (UTC)
According to the maps, Montenegro would seem to be just a part of Dalmatia. Benkarnell 12:44, 7 September 2008 (UTC)
Ok just testing my new found HTML skills thanks to Padraic. Will perhaps open a new article soon :) Geof 13:00 9 September 2008 (AEST)

Would you guys mind if I got Montenegro? Misterxeight 20:55, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Put it this way...I don't know that there's a problem per se with taking up a territory you're interested in, but at the same time, I want to mention that when I came I spent the better part of a year fashioning Louisianne to my ideas, enriching it, contributing and working with others before I branched out into other nations. I'd hate for you to get interested in Montenegro as well and end up having two half-developed countries. For that matter, if you wanted to work on Montenegro, since its territory falls in with Dalmatia, you'll want to make sure that you coordinate heavily with Frank/Ferko as his ideas for Dalmatia have been stewing and brewing for a good number of years.
After all, the goal here is not to flesh out for fleshing out sake. The goal really is to build a beautiful collaborative tapestry, and I'd hate to see you spend your efforts broadly, when you've already made such an interesting start with Greece. BoArthur 21:47, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Could it being part of Dalmatia be a fluke? I mean a lot of pages mention Montenegro, the Ottoman Empire's page even mention it's independence. The only reason I would want it is to make it be annexed by Greece through a puppet king swearing servitude to the laurel leaf crown. Misterxeight 21:53, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

To steal a quote: "No Montenegro for you!" We're well aware of your ideas for an aggrandised Greece, and have been aware of this since about the first day you posted to Conculture. Frankly, it's getting rather old. To steal another quote: "You can wrap an old fish in paper..." Take Dan's advice while you can and stick with Greece. You still have a lot of work to do preparing some kind of proposal for discussion. Haven't seen much of that yet. Other issues need work as well. Elemtilas 03:06, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Am I getting banned now? Misterxeight 21:59, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

We'll discuss this offline. Elemtilas 03:06, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
I see no reason why you would be banned, unless you are trying to "get banned". I gently and firmly remind you, Misterxeight of the principle of Quod Scripsi Scripsi (maybe you should re-read it). We can't just throw aside something that has been accepted as long as Montenegro's connection with Dalmatia, even if it is a fluke. Because this is part of Frank's Dalmatia, you're going to have to talk with him at length about this and have his permission for such a change before we can consider it, and it will take a general proposal to the group. Ill Bethisad is not a role playing game. It's not a game of Risk. This is not about "who gets the most wins."
I appreciate your interest in building Greece up, but the way you're moving with Greece is very brusque, and frankly makes me question your motives here somewhat. Before we can accept this idea, you're going to have to work with Frank and make a joint proposal to the group for approval. BoArthur 22:06, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
No one's banning anyone, and Montenegro's not a fluke. It's part of Dalmatia's well thought out history. Check out Dalmatia#History. Montenegro's mentioned several times: part of medieval Dalmatia, independent state at some point, part of the Ottoman Empire, independent in the 1880s, annexed to Dalmatia after GW1. It says, "Montenegro no longer exists, it is once again part of Dalmatia as it was before the Turks entered Europe. Montenegro was basically an artificial state created to give an Austrian ally south of Dalmatian Hercegovina." Benkarnell 22:08, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
As Ben has pointed out there is history, just not under the title Montenegro. If you REALLY want to see things move that way, you're going to have to talk with Ferko/Frank who has the prior claim to the area, and with whom you will have to collaborate before making any such change. QSS, pure and simple. BoArthur 22:13, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

I know I have to read everything to make sure stuff like this happens again, thanks guys :) Just a question though, do we have a section of long, well-thought history on every nation somewhere in the wiki? Misterxeight 22:16, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

I only knew about Dalmatia because I had just read it the other day (while putting Istria together). Benkarnell 23:51, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
No, we don't...histories are contained here in part, but there are other websites where it's contained, as well as in the history of the Conculture Web Group. You may want to send Ferko a private e-mail to make sure that you find everything he's "published" on Dalmatia's history. BoArthur 22:23, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Like Geo-Cities? Anyway I have another question. How long did it take you for Louisianne to become a fairly well developed nation? What did you do to have it turn out that way? Misterxeight 22:27, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

I did what you hve done and will do with Greece--learned the Ill Bethisad history of the place...and added my ideas to the mix, much like you've done with Greece currently. I've thought about their culture, the influences that would have been different *there* and *here*, not just history, but cultural. How would the return of the Hagia Sophia change the Orthodox church? etc. And with Greece, and the changes in IB from essentially roman times forward makes a very fertile playground to develop history in.BoArthur 22:40, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
That's what I was thinking. I don't really like that Greece if 4 or 5th Rome, I want it to be like the 2nd Greek empire. The only thing I want to maintain of Byzantium/East Rome is just the architectural influences & religion.

Misterxeight 22:47, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

To be honest, modern Greece isn't anything Rome. The only connexion it has with Rome is the new king's pretention to the Byzantine / Roman throne. If you want it to be the Hellenic Empire discussed months ago, king Constantine should repudiate any claims to his ancestor's imperial title, then ensure that his titles align with this Greek ideal. That would allay any trepidation the Kemrese and British in general might feel regarding his actions in that regard. Previous Greek kings have not had this problem!Elemtilas 03:06, 11 September 2008 (UTC)
To be fair though, it's more than one king: it is an entire political movement of which he is the front man. Since his biography and antics have gotten more attention of late, I think the fast-growing Imperialist movement gets ignored. It's not just one young man with pretensions; it's a whole side of the Greek national conversation. Benkarnell 04:14, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

I never really made C out to want to be too much of a Roman based ruler, if I did, that's the opposite of what I mean. His official title is "His Highness, Emperor o the Greeks". Let Italy be Rome, this sleeply little peninsula does not have identity isuues. The only I'm keeping is the flag, which is just based of an old design of Rome. But of course we can always make a new one if you guys think everyone will get confused. Misterxeight 23:36, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

This of course means Constantine is Constantine I now. Plus I;m having trouble with the years of regained Constantinople. Misterxeight 23:39, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

I don't see any reason to change his numeral. Even if it technically gives the wrong impression, that is precisely the kind of error that makes things feel "real." And if the foreign press get the wrong end of the stick, well that is hardly unusual is it? Look how many people think the USA is a country of cowboys, that the British are all cockneys and tea-sipping, buck-teethed tweed-wearers, or that all Arabs are ignorant and violent. Zahir 18:30, 12 September 2008 (UTC)


How has everyone gone about making their maps?

Would love to make some new ones of the HRE, but my computer skills letme down again :( Anyone got any ideas? Geof 9th September 2008 @ 13:10 (AEST)

Jan van Steenbergen may have his originals... BoArthur 18:31, 9 September 2008 (UTC)
FWIW, Geof, I've used MSPaint and Photoshop both. Both work, both give decent results. BoArthur 22:26, 9 September 2008 (UTC)

Ben made a blank political map which you can color. There's also a huge, non IB formatted map which is very detailed at [2] Misterxeight 00:11, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

For my maps of Turkestan, I started with Jan's original map of the state and adapted heavily. One of the Türkistan Hava Yolları airline route maps was based on an early adaptation of Jan' map; the international route map was adapted from one of the big IB world maps, though I forget which one. (This is me giving all credit where credit is due!) Geoff

Oh, that's right!

I just remembered something: South Florida. I know the Irish are still trying to pressure the RTC into doing as their doing, and may still stick with that proposal map that is on the South Florida page. I just want to know if anyone else wanted to make any remarks or anything... Seth 03:06, 10 September 2008 (UTC)

You can bet the South Floridians, especially those in the RTC ZOC will have something to say! There will soon be some more news smuggled out of Florida... Elemtilas 03:12, 11 September 2008 (UTC)

Homepage down?

Is anyone else getting a "This page cannot be displayed" message when going to the homepage? Benkarnell 15:55, 12 September 2008 (UTC)

Not me. Zahir 18:10, 12 September 2008 (UTC)
In Portugal not also.--Pedromoderno 00:33, 13 September 2008 (UTC)

*Here's* and *there's* lists of images

Geoff started an article (List of Jet Fighters) on which we can see what jet planes *there* correspond to real world ones. I wonder if couldn't be made the same about images of people in IB whose pictures came out from real world, digitally manipulated or not. I always was curious about to know who really are some of the faces in the pics which appear in the articles.--Pedromoderno 00:32, 13 September 2008 (UTC)


Hi all! What languages do you guys speak? Natural languages and conlangs etc. GeofTurner 16:00 9th Oct 08 (AEDST) *just remembered we're in daylight savings now!*

We don't Daylight Savings until November in the US. We're weird (I know--nothing new). English, French, Swedish with understanding of German, Russian, Arabic and the other Germanic/Romance languages (to a small degree). BoArthur 13:55, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
I speak joual/french, english and a bit of both spanish and farsi. and we had daylight saving last weekend here in australia.--Marc Pasquin 14:23, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
What exactly is Joual? Geofturner 16:56 13th Oct 08
I speak portuguese, spanish, english, a bit of french and I used to speak a little bit of lingala, but I lost most of practice on this one.--Pedromoderno 14:46, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
I'm one of the boring ones. Only speak English. Took French in high school and college, remembering almost none of it now. *sigh* Zahir 15:25, 9 October 2008 (UTC)
Boring? Hardly. Being the Maven of Culture for IB, I should say you're anything but! BoArthur 17:34, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

I only speak English & Greek :( but I have to learn Spanish Misterxeight 23:29, 9 October 2008 (UTC)

I speak English, Kazakh, what I can still remember of high school German and French, and just enough Russian to look like I ought to know more than I do. Geoff 05:25, 10 Oct 08 (USCT)

I'm rather surprised with some of the languages you guys speak!--Pedromoderno 12:46, 10 October 2008 (UTC)

If you want conlangs as well, then add Franj and Lauranthea to my list. Neither of these are in IB, and Lauranthea isn't IB-able. Geoff 16:48, 10 Oct 08 (USCT)
English. I practice German when I can but get get by on the Internet given enough time. I'm learning Spanish. Benkarnell 21:53, 10 October 2008 (UTC)
czech (mother tongue), slovak, english, all fluently; german (both mediocre, speaking and reading), russian (much better at reading than speaking) and spanish (dtto as russian) with much less fluency. those other langs are only reading: all other slavic except for slovenian and bulgarian (only with dictionary) and portuguese. i speak fluently no conlang, except for really broken arkian. Jan II. 11:41, 11 October 2008 (UTC)
Mother tongues: Portuguese and German; fluent: English, Spanish; less fluent: Esperanto, French; read & can make myself understood: Italian, Dutch; can read > 25%: Danish / Norwegian / Swedish (if simple text); can pronounce reasonably: Japanese, Russian. I recently missed a chance of meeting Jan Van Steenbergen in person - presumably in Hamburg - and exchanging a few words in broken Wenedyk (me) and broken Xliponian (him). ;-) Oh well, I'm back in Brasil now (technically that's Paraná *there*). :-( Kyrmse 20:28, 12 October 2008 (UTC)

Wow! that's awesome! we should incorporate them all more into IB somehow. althought dont ask me how, cause im ridiculously hungover lol Geofturner 17:00 13th Oct 08 (AEDST)

Well, wouldn't good Xliponian (you) and good Wenedyk (me) have been better? ;) Anyway. Mother tongue: Dutch. Fluent in Polish and English. Fairly good knowledge of German and French. Read (and make myself understood): Russian. Largely passive knowledge: Ukrainian. Also had Latin and (Ancient) Greek in school for six years, but Greek mostly forgotten. Those are the languages I've actually learned. There are numerous other languages that I can understand "by proxy", but just like anybody who knows English can understand Scots, anybody who knows Dutch can understand Afrikaans, anybody who knows Polish can understand Belorussian, etc.etc.etc.
As for conlangs... Well, I have a good working knowledge of my own Wenedyk. I can fairly quickly produce fairly accurate texts in it without ever checking the grammar or the dictionary, but since I never speak it, I don't know if I would easily handle a conversation with my Venedic spokesperson; he happens to be the creator of Polish and that's the language in which we communicate... —IJzeren Jan Uszkiełtu? 12:13, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
I am fluent only in my mother tongue of English, but I can read (very basic) German, and I litter my vocabulary with small phrases from Yiddish, German, Russian, Japanese, French, Spanish and Irish Gaelic. Does this mean I can even read most of those languages? No. I just happen to know people who are fluent in them, and some stuff tends to gets passed around. Seth 16:01, 20 November 2008 (UTC)
I speak fluently in Polish(native) and English (C1-level), intermediate Russian and German (my Father used to said that you should learn languages of your enemies). I knew basic Latin and ancient Greek(witch is actually not very common those times). I can roughly understand most of Romance, Germanic and Slavic languages. I have also some interest in Japanese. As for constructed onces Wenedyk is only one I knew. As IT student I attended 'Formal linguistic' course witch represents most of Chomsky hierarchy ways of representation of formalisms. Follow by white rabbit 16:33, 21 November 2008 (UTC)
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