File talk:Ae-political-map.png

Wasn't Meath further up? --Sikulu 08:55, 14 March 2006 (PST)

It's important that you don't confuse the layout of Ireland *here* with that of Ireland *there*. Unlike An Mhí (Meath) *here*, it was never absorbed into the province of Laighean (Leinster). The areas marked with boxes and red lines are the provinces (cúigí) and within the provinces the territories (tuatha) are delimited with green lines.

The majority of the old province comprises the north of the new province *there*. --Kgaughan 16:01, 14 March 2006 (PST)

Check here. --Sikulu 00:32, 15 March 2006 (PST)

Your first mistake is the think that those old borders in Ireland were particularly fixed back then. The reality was quite different. The borders between the under-kingdoms shifted quite a bit over time down to wars and shifting alliances. Notice how huge chunks of Connacht in that map are now part of the other three provinces *here* today.

If you want a parallel *here* consider how the Duchy of Saxony shifted from northwest Germany to south east Germany. The situation with Laighan, An Mhí, and Airgealla, especially Airgealla. With Laighan and An Mhí, the current situation arose much later. In the late 18th century, there was a partial repartition of the two southeastern provinces, with the Cambrian-dominated areas becoming Laighan and the Irish-dominated areas becoming An Mhí. It had shifted somewhat in that time anyway due to estates being broken up and merged over time. --Kgaughan 05:11, 15 March 2006 (PST)

While were on the subject, what happened to Oriel? --Sikulu 08:57, 14 March 2006 (PST)

It didn't go anywhere: that's Airgealla. --Kgaughan 16:01, 14 March 2006 (PST)

Not according to this it's not. (Sorry if I seem rude). --Sikulu 00:32, 15 March 2006 (PST)

That only shows that the Airgealla expanded up into Aileach after it splintered into Tír Eógain, Tír Chonaill and Tír Énda and the latter two were absorbed by Airgealla. --Kgaughan 05:11, 15 March 2006 (PST)

Sorry. The reason I ask these questions is because there is *no* information in the history section of the Ireland Article. --Sikulu 05:34, 15 March 2006 (PST)

No worries. The details are (mostly) in the conculture list archives and some (the division of Aileach) happened historically *here* in the 1300s. What's slightly different is that how Ireland ended up divided up in the 1500s. The present day tuatha correspond mostly to the earldoms that were established during that century, with the Uí Domhnaill family as Earls of Tír Chonnail, what remained of the Uí Niall family as Earls of Airgealla, the Uí Conor family in Tír Breifne, Iarchonnachta split between two Hiberno-Norman families, Mac Uilliam (from whom Oscar de Bhílde is descended) in the north and de Burca in the south, and so on. Tír Boruma is, predicably, the former earldom of the Uí Bríain family; Osraighe, the de Clair (Mac Murchada) family; Éogannacht, the gallowglass Uí Súilleabháin in the west and Mac Cartaighe in the east; Déise, the FitzGerald de Buitlear family, and so on. Laighean itself was a series of Kemrese liberties and Baronies for the most part. --Kgaughan 09:33, 15 March 2006 (PST)